1UP justifies SCEA’s pulled prerelease support with MLB 08 review

by pastapadre
Posted March 19th, 2008 at 3:24 am

Back in early January I wrote an article regarding how a few companies had decided to no longer provide 1UP/EGM with prerelease copies of their games. The companies in question felt that they were not being treated fairly and that they could go to other outlets instead. This wasn’t a case of trying to buy off reviews. Instead it was simply wanting their titles to be treated with the proper level of respect. There is obviously no way to stop them from reviewing the game however they weren’t going to provide them with the copies to do so.

One of those companies was SCEA who produces the MLB The Show franchise. Last year 1UP gave MLB 07 a ridiculous 5.5 which was the lowest score the game received. While people will concentrate on the low score the text of the review was riddled with misinformation and factual mistakes.

1UP has just posted its review of MLB 08: The Show giving it a score in their new rating scale of a B-. That equates out to a 6.7 per their system (of C=5) which is how Metacritic converted it. That is the second lowest score given to the game with only the embarrassing 6/10 from X-Play coming in below it. No other media outlet has even scored the game below an 8. Believe it or not this makes it two straight years that The Show is rated lower than 2K’s franchise by 1UP. This year MLB 2K8 on the PS3 got a 7.5 from them. Lets take a look at some of the points made in the review.

Sliding into a base kicks up a convincing cloud of dust, but it comes from a brown basepath that doesn’t really look like dirt. Wrigley Field’s ivy-covered walls look fine when seen from afar, but as the outfielder approaches, all that foliage looks more like bad wallpaper.

I really don’t even know what to say to this. That a one page review goes and cites these type of things early on is a sign of things to come.

lackluster commentary detracts from the whole experience. Sony brought in a professional sportscaster team anchored by San Diego Padres play-by-play announcer Matt Vasgersian, but they sound almost bored and isolated in their parts, as if they were recorded in separate studios.

If The Show’s commentary is “lackluster” I wonder how 2K8’s would be labeled. At the very least they call the Tampa Bay Rays by their name and didn’t just cut out the word “devil” and splice the remaining audio back together (as 2K8 did). The commentary is actually excellent and is often cited as one of the strong points of The Show.

But it’s unnecessarily small, compressing the movement of the meter, and even for ace pitchers it moves so fast you’re just stabbing at the buttons rather than getting in rhythm with the motion.

What??? Seriously, if you can’t handle the feel of a pitching meter maybe playing a baseball game isn’t for you. It has always felt natural timing wise going with each pitcher’s motion.

To make matters worse, even nailing the perfect release doesn’t guarantee results. This is where that pitch meter comes back into play. A pitcher who’s lost it on a given pitch won’t put that pitch where you want it no matter how well you groove the meter….While your pitcher is doing well, the system succeeds at giving you a sensation of accurate location and control….But when it starts to unravel, it falls apart completely. Give up a run and your confidence takes such a hit that every pitch suffers. Make one mistake with the touchy meter and a pitch can be rendered nearly unthrowable.

Ironically the meter is being knocked here for making it difficult to spot pitches at times. The opposite is the usual argument, so far as 2K determined they needed a whole new system to try and replicate the sometimes erratic nature of pitching. Please, if anyone has ever experienced the inability to control their pitches completely in the Show, speak up. I don’t expect anyone will.

Could this review be retribution on 1UP’s part? Possibly, but it’s hard to believe they would’ve given the game a fair review regardless considering their history of overall poor reviews for all sports games. So kudos to Sony for taking a stand and not putting up with the mistreatment of The Show. This review from 1UP just proved it was the right decision.

When it comes down to it MLB 08 The Show has two areas where it could really use improvement. Collision detection and online play. Funny though that they weren’t even mentioned as detractions in the 1UP review. In my assessment other than those two things the game shines as one of the most enjoyable, deep, and well made sports titles ever. So if I were to grade it out I would look at those downfalls, how much they meant to me, and measure that against everything else. In the case of online play (as disappointing as it can be at times) MLB 2K8 is actually worse in that area. So while the game isn’t perfect, it’s clearly the best baseball game available despite 1UP and X-Play trying to convince otherwise. If you haven’t already checked it out make sure to read my MLB 2K8 vs MLB 08: The Show comparison article.

Tags:

Sidewinder

[quote comment="15859"]Why is Bumblebee acting immature and flaming us on which game we like better? Why so serious?? I have both systems and have played both! I wish the two games merged ideas and features actually. I just don't think Bumbler's got what it takes to be competitive in 2k's offering and chooses to bash it instead...grow up. You can always go back to classic bro.[/quote]

You little boy are clueless. Go play your Wii.

Sidewinder

[quote comment="15895"]-
I'll never understand why some people feel the need to trash what someone else likes, or spend time defending something they like

If someone came on here and said they thought Intellivision baseball was still the baseball sim ever, I'd disagree with them and leave it at that and not try to tell him he's an idiot or stupid or convince him NOT to have fun with it

Just enjoy what you want to - not anyone's job to police how other people should enjoy what they want to[/quote]

Exactly, so quit taking it personally that you like an arcade game that isnt ready for primetime yet, and the majority like a true sim game. No big deal, just move along. Maybe one day, you will get it. Until then, better to be thought a fool, then to speak and remove all doubt.

flyingfinn

They gave Madden 08 an A... how can you trust any review from these guys???

Eski

I am glad to see there are so many passionate gamers in this forum. This is where competition for developers, IMO, promotes innovation.

Both games are solid. Everyone will have an opinion and likes / dislikes of a specific game. Either way, if you enjoy one game more than the other, what you think is all that matters since it is your time you are spending with the game.

Console baseball is better than its ever been. Hitting and pitching is more realistic than in year's past and the visuals are getting downright sick.

Either way, you can't lose as long as your happy and, most importantly, having fun.

kevin

as mentioned in above post

"I grew really tired and bored of The Show, despite its better graphics. It’s all about gameplay and presentation man! The Show doesn’t have any “shows” like 2K8’s intro, 7th inning and post-game “shows”. lol"

Talking about presentation and gamplay, I owned MLB 2K8 and I can't count the number of times an easy grounder to second base would still result in an infield single, to a guy like Frank Thomas! All because the second baseman decides to double pump before he LOBS!! the ball to firstbase, after the play though, the team whips the ball around the infeild. Great gameplay and awesome presentation, LOL, MLB 2K8 sold... Hello MLB 08 The Show. I'll admit, a seen a few minor glitches in the 25 games I played with The Show, compared to the 25 glitches per game in 2K8... I can manage

bull

Let me tell you all something... I currently have in my posession The Show which was rented. I bought 2K8 for the 360. Now, I'm thinking the PS3 sucks period, IMHO. But the fact is, 2K8 is better than the Show simply because it's more fun.

I grew really tired and bored of The Show, despite its better graphics. It's all about gameplay and presentation man! The Show doesn't have any "shows" like 2K8's intro, 7th inning and post-game "shows". lol

CrimsonVoodoo

Seriously - is there like a The Show Defense League that you're required to sign up for when you purchse this game? Anywhere on the Internet if anyone says some aspect of the game is only fair to middlin', all of a sudden a swarm of fans come swooping in -

In this thread alone:

" are u nuts ... then u are retarded"

"a bunch of idiots there (sic) babies"

"know what you're talking about before you say something dumb"

"anything less than a 8 is just a plain hater ... PERIOD"

"to even defend 2K8 is a joke"

"give me a break, you know nothing about baseball games"

"those are the ones who play RPG's and Mario games"

I don't think a single person, or review has called The Show a "bad" game. Likewise we need to acknowledge some people have different opinions and that's, you know, OK.

I'll never understand why some people feel the need to trash what someone else likes, or spend time defending something they like

If someone came on here and said they thought Intellivision baseball was still the baseball sim ever, I'd disagree with them and leave it at that and not try to tell him he's an idiot or stupid or convince him NOT to have fun with it

Just enjoy what you want to - not anyone's job to police how other people should enjoy what they want to

Kevin

I sold my 360 along with 2k8 and all other games to purchase the PS3 just for the one reason... MLB 08 the show. I could not stand MLB 2k8. I am going to hold back on my full opinion of the games, but want to add.... MLB 08 The Show, made me fall for baseball gaming alll over again. I can finally retire my EA sports MVP 2005... :)

Sidewinder

This is such a no-brainer. The Show 08 PS3 is the best rendition of the game of baseball on a gaming platform. It is just that simple. I have played every baseball game since the Intellivision. I have played on the field at the college and pro levels. I have played with and against some of the games biggest names in the last 20 years, so I have the background to just put it out there. The Show is the most polished, mentally deep, intuitive baseball game yet.

You know you have a true baseball gaming experience when all the arcade controls take a back seat to the mental aspects of the game, because the controls are so intuitive and smooth. The chess match between a pitcher and batter comes to the surface. Why is that? Because you are not worried about throwing a meatball down the middle every time you miss your timing or the stick screws up. That is not the game of baseball. That is a poor arcade approach to the game that doesnt work. Plain and simple. It is not real sim baseball.

What is real sim baseball? Having realistic pitch physics, deep pitch counts with many foul balls, pitchers sometimes throwing 100 pitches by the 6th inning. When have you seen that in a video baseball game before? Never. I dont care if the game doesnt use an analog method if the end results are realistic. Again, no-brainer.

I applaude 2K for trying something out of the box, but their execution is half-arsed. At least until it is fixed. I had alot of fun with 2k7-360 after the late June patch came out. Bought the Classic ballparks too. I saw the little fixes that were tweaking the game for the better the last half of 07 too. 2k7 actually took me away from my fully modded MVP 05 PC game that I had played for a few years. So I had high hopes for 2k8. But, after playing The Show 08 demo on my new PS3, I knew they were in completely different leagues and The Show had set a new standard that all other baseball games were to be measured against from that point.

That is not opinion, it is common sense fact based on a foundation of 25+ years of experience, on and off the field. And I feel hopeful that those of you who dont get it yet, someday will. This is the Holy Grail of Baseball people, plain and simple and to miss the boat because of some arcade analog control gimmic is just plain ignorant. The novelty wore off very quickly with 2k8, especially with the framerate issues. By the way, the 360 2k8 runs quite a bit better at 720P than 1080. The PS3 2k8 is brutal at 720 or 1080.

I have had mostly great online game experiences with The Show. I have a TW Roadrunner 10 Mbps connection. Sometimes it is butter smooth, but once in awhile there will be lag issues. I played a guy from Canada and I am in Southern California and it was perfectly smooth. I love how it keeps your accumalative online stats, too. I'm talking about full pitching and batting stats!

The AI is really top-notch from on-field strategy to roster/lineup decisions, you feel like you are playing an intelligent pro level player that truly understands the game.

I never played The Show 07 or any of The Show games before, so I cant say what the improvements are in 08. Just that this game is what baseball people have been waiting for. The combination of hand/eye skill incorporated with all the true mental aspects of the game rolled into one amazing package.

I would like to see collision detection between players and Classic ballparks in future versions. I really love some of the Spring Training ballparks, even if not accurate and some fictional. The North Arizona one is great. Check it out.

I have played about 25 games online now and around 20 games offline and I am still seeing new things, that make you appreciate the efforts/execution that Sony has achieved here.

Bravo Sony!

Some people will never "get it". They are just wired differently. Those are the ones that play RPGs and Mario games. Alot of people dont get Sports or maybe just Baseball. Those people should not be writing reviews that are so far off the mark, that they make a fool out of themselves. And people in the know, see it for what it is. Those that dont, suck it up, look in the mirror, and make the adjustments, or just move along, to where your genetics do allow you to fit in.

Common sense, people, common sense. You cant fit a square peg into a round hole. Sometimes, it's not the other guy, it's you!

Bumble14

Ohh..and you call me immature yet you make a "witty" spin on my name...you're awesome **two thumbs up!**

Bumble14

[quote comment="15859"]Why is Bumblebee acting immature and flaming us on which game we like better? Why so serious?? I have both systems and have played both! I wish the two games merged ideas and features actually. I just don't think Bumbler's got what it takes to be competitive in 2k's offering and chooses to bash it instead...grow up. You can always go back to classic bro.[/quote]

What are you talking about? I can go back to classic? When was I having a hard time/ ripping on 2k's control scheme? I don't have what it takes to be competitive? I don't even play 2k8 because it is terrible, so why would I care if I was "competitive"? That's like me trying to call you out in a game of Double Dribble....desperate much?

I love baseball games and I call it like I see it. I'm happy you guys are all liking 2k8, but the whole point of this story by Pasta wasn't which game you enjoy more, it was how did 1up kill MLB and praise 2K8. I'm pretty sure all my posts illustrate why The Show should have gotten higher praise from the 1up crew.

pastapadre

so just to show that the patch is no guarantee that the main issues would be fixed (at least completely) today the Bully patch came (another Take Two title) that was supposed to fix framerate and freezing issues. Apparently not only hasn't it fixed them but some people are saying its made things worse.

http://www.joystiq.com/2008/03/20/bully-patch-n...

DA Yankees Win

MLB 2K8 is the best baseball game I've ever played.

Darkheath

I just want to know why so many people consider MVP '05 the "Holy Grail" of baseball games. I picked it up recently to see what all the fuss was about and while I enjoy it, I had to set some EXTREME sliders to get any realistic games out of it. I do like the minor leagues and franchise modes though.

pastapadre

I have my doubts that the patch will fix the framerate dramatically. They’ve been aware of the framerate problem for months and didn’t address it then and their “workaround” right now only improves it to an extent. Plus the PS3 people don’t even get that. The game isn’t just going to magically run at 60fps after the patch...

r00tabaga

Why is Bumblebee acting immature and flaming us on which game we like better? Why so serious?? I have both systems and have played both! I wish the two games merged ideas and features actually. I just don't think Bumbler's got what it takes to be competitive in 2k's offering and chooses to bash it instead...grow up. You can always go back to classic bro.

r00tabaga

Where 2k's framerate would be most the annoying, would be in their batter/pitcher interface...and it's clearly not. Everyone and their mother are running with the fps thing. When the patch finally is released and framerate is restored at a constant 60, where are you guys gonna attack next? Things like commentary can be turned off. Sliders are put in for more SIM players but 2k sets the default for casual guys to pick up and play...what's wrong w/that?? Both games are good and both need to improve. OPINIONS ARE OPINIONS-

BTW, Pasta thx for the NHL08 roster update. I've been coming here more l8ly and appreciate the heads up...

Bumble14

[quote comment="15850"]hey pasta? you sound too much like a MLB:The Show defender. Some of the points the guys made at 1up like the weak play by play and graphic detail is correct. I also think you've overstated this framerate problem in 2k8, is there some stutter, yes, for no little than 1/8 of a second, nothing that makes it unplayable, and your comments made it easy for any kid to download the 2k demo and bash it. Its so easy to get the public to be negative about something nowadays, it seemed like you tossed a meatball to your Sony/EA FanBoys to knock 2k. I've played both, The SHOW is like most games on PS3, its the same game engine, but with HD graphics. Nothing stands out in that game. Clearly the Pitching in 2k is intimidating, but when you really play both games, 2k is better. The Presentation is better, Sounds of the game, The Franchise, and the player stats. Sorry Pasta, I'm not feeling you on this one. You've been exposed, you're a Sony/EA Fanboy[/quote]

Give me a break. You know nothing about baseball games.

Why don't you come after me next? Go back and read all my previous posts standing up for 2k, being objective, even ripping on the Show for the same reasons you guys are (non analog scheme,etc). Well I played it and was completely wrong. The Show is absolutely amazing- and I will say it again, the 2K game that I completely defended and stood up for is a MAJOR downgrade from 2k7. The game DOESN'T RUN AS SMOOTH AS GRIFFEY ON N64. How can you all know that, and then try and say the game doesn't have a problem?? If it didn't have a problem, why was it patched within 24 hours of it's release?

Like I said before- people ripping the Show are just mad because it's a PS3 exclusive and they only own 360- I was one of those people a few weeks back, bashing Sony and the Show because I was just mad I didn't have a PS3 to try the game out on. Well after biting the bullet, buying a PS3 and the Show, I can clearly say that it is far superior to 2K8, not to mention any baseball game that has been released to date.

Stop bashing a game because you don't have the system it is exclusive for. I GUARANTEE that if the Show was cross platform people would not be playing 2K--did anyone play 2k when MVP 04-05 was released? Yeah, I didn't think so. Blame 2K for making a garbage exclusive game and making you all play it if you own a 360- not the Show for being an excellent game.

Nick

2K8's pitching mechanic is simply superb and so realistic. I love it and will play 2K8 all summer long.

The Show is good but since the name of the game is pitching, and the analog stick approach of 2K8 beeing way more realistic and fun compared to the usual and boring meter thing on The Show... I prefer 2K8.

Eski

[quote comment="15853"]Please re-review these games once the frame rate and online pings are fixed. You better be fair, Pasta! 2k really shines...[/quote]

That is another issue with 2K...Why should we, as gamers, purchase a game that needs to be fixed post-release? $60, to many people, is not easy to part with and to buy a game that needs a fix, especially with frame rate, etc. is not acceptable.

If a bug is caught post-release I can handle a patch but to hope a patch is released to fix the major part of the game is ludicrous....

Eski

[quote comment="15850"]hey pasta? you sound too much like a MLB:The Show defender. Some of the points the guys made at 1up like the weak play by play and graphic detail is correct. I also think you've overstated this framerate problem in 2k8, is there some stutter, yes, for no little than 1/8 of a second, nothing that makes it unplayable, and your comments made it easy for any kid to download the 2k demo and bash it. Its so easy to get the public to be negative about something nowadays, it seemed like you tossed a meatball to your Sony/EA FanBoys to knock 2k. I've played both, The SHOW is like most games on PS3, its the same game engine, but with HD graphics. Nothing stands out in that game. Clearly the Pitching in 2k is intimidating, but when you really play both games, 2k is better. The Presentation is better, Sounds of the game, The Franchise, and the player stats. Sorry Pasta, I'm not feeling you on this one. You've been exposed, you're a Sony/EA Fanboy[/quote]

I don't think Pasta was defending a game as much as he was criticizing a flawed review. I, too, have played both games and, in my humble opinion, the frame rate in 2K does impact gameplay. Not so much that it makes it unplayable but enough that it takes the immersion out of the game.

After seeing The Show's smooth visuals, it is hard to argue that frame rate doesn't matter especially in a baseball game. Baseball is all about timing and if the frame rate is choppy it can impact that timing.

Also, I don't believe that Pasta was saying that 2K is a bad game. He is clearly stating that The Show receiving a 6 or 6.7 or whatever the hell 1Up scored it, does not reflect how good the game actually is.

I have been a fan of 2K until this most recent release. I had high hopes but 2K8 took a step backward...I think most 2K fans expected a stronger frame rate, improved visuals and more extras. The new pitching mechanic is innovative and fun but is something I don't see other developers emulating....

smokez4Dayz

Please re-review these games once the frame rate and online pings are fixed. You better be fair, Pasta! 2k really shines...

smokez4Dayz

hey pasta? you sound too much like a MLB:The Show defender. Some of the points the guys made at 1up like the weak play by play and graphic detail is correct. I also think you've overstated this framerate problem in 2k8, is there some stutter, yes, for no little than 1/8 of a second, nothing that makes it unplayable, and your comments made it easy for any kid to download the 2k demo and bash it. Its so easy to get the public to be negative about something nowadays, it seemed like you tossed a meatball to your Sony/EA FanBoys to knock 2k. I've played both, The SHOW is like most games on PS3, its the same game engine, but with HD graphics. Nothing stands out in that game. Clearly the Pitching in 2k is intimidating, but when you really play both games, 2k is better. The Presentation is better, Sounds of the game, The Franchise, and the player stats. Sorry Pasta, I'm not feeling you on this one. You've been exposed, you're a Sony/EA Fanboy

r00tabaga

and BTW, who is this Dill dude? He sure is being a...dare I say......pickle! Is his job here to be a dork?

r00tabaga

[quote comment="15796"][quote comment="15780"]I don't use the announcers so I don't care about that. From what I played, I liked the Show. Besides the "obvious by now" framerate issue w/2k, you sound like you haven't played the game at all and are reaching...btw, the animations and sigs are better than anything the Show has. I said they both need work tho...I just prefer 2k's controls alot more right now..................sorry-[/quote]
lol, this is funny to me, I know Pasta personally, and I can tell you, if anything, he is an Xbox 360 fan boy. He has both games, I know becuase I have played them both, on his system. So to you I would say, know what you are talking about before you say something dumb. Also, how can you praise 2k's "animations" when the game craps on it self every time a ball is hit on the field. Animation equales images in motion, if the frame rate sucks, the ANIMATION sucks, so yea, great point dude.[/quote]
That wasn't aimed at your boy Pasta, it was in response to a different post "big brother"....

Bryan

I picked up 2k7 last year for the 360 in midsummer. Hadn't touched a baseball game in years and I suddenly got the urge, and 2k7 was the only game available for that platform. I must admit. I liked it then. I played a full season...won a ridiculous amount of games--ramped up the dificulty...kept winning. Then messed around with the sliders. Still won a lot of games. Ended up winning the WS. The game was still fun...but not very realistic.

Fast-forward to this year. I didn't own a PS3 up the the release of 2k8 or The Show. Followed the coverage of both games on this site and others. After reading all of the gripes with 2k8, I went ahead and reluctantly bought a PS3 for The Show, and all I can say is WOW.

BY FAR the most realistic BB game I have ever played. The franchise mode is incredibly deep. Having the ability to control you team (the Tribe for me) and both of its minor league teams is really fun. Calling up players who are hot and sending down your starters for so that they can get a break or can try to work out of a cold streak is so fun. All of the management options are really cool to mess around with.

Onto the Gameplay. My record so far this season with the Indians is 35 and 24. Realistic stats as far as batting average, home runs, rbi..etc. In this aspect it blows 2k7 out of the water. For instance, last night I played the Tigers away. Wind was blowing in. Anything hit deep and in the air just stalled in the outfield. Small ball was the only way to score. They went up 1-0 and held the lead until the bottom of the ninth. I got Hafner to single...pinch ran with a rookie. He stole second. 1st out...2nd out. Pinch-hit with a hot rookie. Worked the count to 3-2...and he rips on to left center for double. Player scores from second. The game goes 15 innings. Both teams use almost all pitchers. I small ball my way to a gut on second...get a bloop single on a hit-and-run and guy scores...bring in, literally, my last reliever...and he closes the door. I win 2-1 in 15th inning. Very gratifying.

I can say in the hundred or son game of 2k7 I played...situations like this never happened. You either won big or lost.

By far The Show is the most realistic game I have played.

Bumble14

[quote comment="15822"]Bumble...

I've been playing video baseball games since the days of the original RBI Baseball as well as Baseball Stars on the NES. Through the years I've played the High Heat, Triple Play, All Star Baseball, World Series Baseball and all other series. So I know MY baseball.

For the record, I was a big fan of the All Star Baseball series as I like the player models and was pretty happy with the animations and the gameplay.

When that seres went up in smoke, I had to pledge allegiance to a new franchise, so Ibegan to play 2K baseball...and it was HORRIFIC!

Because of that, I chose to take a couple years off to let the games catch up wit the technology.

I was a big fan of MLB 2K7 as it was my return to video game baseball. Did the game have it's flaws? Absolutely. But I was alble to look past most of them and I believe it played a solid game of baseball.

When I first loaded MLB 2K8, I was definitely disappointed that the graphics took a hit. I was also disappointed to see that I still could not play any team in a franchise mode. But I can honestly say that I'm not really having any major framerate issues (some from time-to-time).

It was difficult to accept and learn the new piching interface...but it is AWESOME. Nothing feels worse than hanging a meatball to Albert Pujols and nothing feels better than getting him looking on a 2-2 curveball.

On top of that, it's my opinion that many people play baseball video games differently. I've yet to have one game that did not play out realistic and most of my scores tend to be in the 4-2, 3-2, 5-4 variety.

I've played the demo of The Show and it is a GREAT game...no question. But for me, I will take watching Tim Lincecum's motion and release or Gary Sheffields bat waggle over the beach ball in the crowd. Again that's my opinion. Also, I enjoy hearing "Crazy Train" play as Chipper Jones comes to the plate...or hearing Sinatra sing "New York, New York" as the anks win...a nice little touch.

In a perfect world, we would have a combination of both of the good aspects of each game, but until that day comes (which will be the day exclusive licenses ends), some people will prefer one game and others will prefer another one.

I dunno why people can't realize this...it's like the whole Madden '05/NFL 2K5 argument all over agan.[/quote]

I respect your opinion (even though I thought the All Sstar baseball series was pretty weak). Did you ever play MVP 05?? Probably the best baseball game ever developed. 2K7 was a good game, but had a lot of things wrong with it.

2K7-2K8 has nice signature animations, and the pitching system is nice- I had no problem picking it up and using it, so I'm not complaining because the I didn't understand the controls. Please find my major problems with 2K8 below:

1.) Bat on Ball physics- they just don't make sense in 2k8-especially with the hit stick. Why am I pulling outside pitches with regularity? The tell tell sign of a good baseball game with good bat on ball physics is to watch instant replay in slow mo and see the rotation of the ball, the contact with the bat, and the resulting ball movement. The Show 08 is spot on--MLB2K8 is not. MVP 05 had the best physics in this category up until the show- 2K8 is severly lacking behind both of these games.

2.)Fielding animations- Is there a reason why all of my outfielders catch the ball by hodling their arms out, heads facing the wrong way? Have you noticed that fielders do not track the ball with their head (i.e. ball tracking in hoops games) in 2k8? Why can a ball roll towards my shorstop and he mysteriously won't scoop it but rather it rolls past him?

3.) Field Size- Have any of you guys actually played in a major league ball park? I have, and as an outfielder let me tell you, those parks are HUGE! How come 2K is not able to convey this sence of scale in their MLB games? It's almost as if player scaling is off--and this leads to several problems fielding. I've noticed your outfielders are pretty much able to track down anything, even gappers, and recovering from a ball hit off the wall isn't that difficult. The Show gives you a sense of depth in the field, and when you are tracking down a gapper, you really have to hustle to get the ball in your glove, and into the cut off man--this is real.

4.)Framerate, Framerate, Framerate- Play the Show and tell me there are no framerate issues on 2k8, seriously. Bottom line is that MVP 05 still runs cleaner in the field than 2k8, and the game is 4 years old. This is unacceptable for a video game that is the officially endorsed product of the MLB.

5.) Details and AI- Let me ask you this...how many times has the cpu bunted/made intelligent small ball plays against you in the 2k series? Personally I have never seen it in a year of 2k7, and almost a month of 2k8. My first game of The Show I had the opposing manager sac bunting while down 3-1 in the 7th, making defensive switches to get a stronger arm in the outfield when I had runners on 1st and 3rd with 1 out, and just playing small ball trying to tie the game up on me/prevent me from extending the lead. It kept me on my toes, and was an excellent addition to games I was playing.

The bottom line is that baseball games are about pitching, fielding and hitting. The Show does all three categories better. Sure, 2K8 has some nice little touches lke the personal songs, etc, but where a baseball game succeeds/fails is in the gameplay, and the Show is rock solid.

I do like the pitching in 2K8, and prefer it to meter pitching, but you can not deny that the Show (simple control scheme or not) plays a darn near perfect game of baseball. That to me is more important than a new control scheme. Someone on here tried comparing 2k8 to NHL 08 because of the control scheme changeup---well there is a major difference--NHL 08 would not have been a success if the game played like garbage..the game plays rock solid..just like the Show.

Chikiboy

Bumble...

I've been playing video baseball games since the days of the original RBI Baseball as well as Baseball Stars on the NES. Through the years I've played the High Heat, Triple Play, All Star Baseball, World Series Baseball and all other series. So I know MY baseball.

For the record, I was a big fan of the All Star Baseball series as I like the player models and was pretty happy with the animations and the gameplay.

When that seres went up in smoke, I had to pledge allegiance to a new franchise, so Ibegan to play 2K baseball...and it was HORRIFIC!

Because of that, I chose to take a couple years off to let the games catch up wit the technology.

I was a big fan of MLB 2K7 as it was my return to video game baseball. Did the game have it's flaws? Absolutely. But I was alble to look past most of them and I believe it played a solid game of baseball.

When I first loaded MLB 2K8, I was definitely disappointed that the graphics took a hit. I was also disappointed to see that I still could not play any team in a franchise mode. But I can honestly say that I'm not really having any major framerate issues (some from time-to-time).

It was difficult to accept and learn the new piching interface...but it is AWESOME. Nothing feels worse than hanging a meatball to Albert Pujols and nothing feels better than getting him looking on a 2-2 curveball.

On top of that, it's my opinion that many people play baseball video games differently. I've yet to have one game that did not play out realistic and most of my scores tend to be in the 4-2, 3-2, 5-4 variety.

I've played the demo of The Show and it is a GREAT game...no question. But for me, I will take watching Tim Lincecum's motion and release or Gary Sheffields bat waggle over the beach ball in the crowd. Again that's my opinion. Also, I enjoy hearing "Crazy Train" play as Chipper Jones comes to the plate...or hearing Sinatra sing "New York, New York" as the anks win...a nice little touch.

In a perfect world, we would have a combination of both of the good aspects of each game, but until that day comes (which will be the day exclusive licenses ends), some people will prefer one game and others will prefer another one.

I dunno why people can't realize this...it's like the whole Madden '05/NFL 2K5 argument all over agan.

The Night Owl

[quote comment="15813"]Last post on this - promise

Dillfav - You must have played a special "extra-choppy" MLB2K8, because the one I own is certainly stutterrific during cuts scenes and replays, but from pitch to hit to throw runs at least competently. I read at another site an opinion from someone I respect, who had just bought the game. It basically amounted to WTF? he had assumed from all the strum & drang that the game was a slideshow, which it's not. Lots of people are merrily playing the game in a very sim fashion and not burning 2K staff in effigy. Really.

Night Owl - thanks for playing into the zealot role so easily. Your post is the one that sums up what I don't get - the CAPS and !!!!!!!! and the "haters" and the rest. Hey, some people DON'T like Prince's guitar playing, and I'm not sure if you actually read the review the guy was all that harsh and saying the game sucked. He just didn't fawn over it and call it the greatest thing since sliced bread, which seems to be a crime

Reviews, outside of whatever specs they provide, are nothing but opinions, and are legitmate. Some movie critics think Citizen Kane is overrated. Some music critics think the Beatles were overrated. Either way you may disagree, but it doesn't make the other person's view less true to them

Enjoy the game (whichever one it is) - no one's opinion should stop you from doing so, and frankly, that's all that matters. Or SHOULD matter anyway[/quote]

You're not getting my point. Maybe some people don't like Prince's style of playing, but to say he CAN'T play a guitar would be insane, that's just like saying Lebron James CAN'T dunk. Some things are just fact and not opinion.

The Night Owl

[quote comment="15811"]Anyone that gives The Show anything less than an 8 is just a plain hater....PERIOD!

Some things are just FACT and not opinion! That's like someone saying Jordan can't play basketball or Prince can't play a guitar. There are some idiots out there that would argue those points with an opinion and say Jordan sucked on the court or Prince is a horrible guitar player. But the FACT is that they both are GREAT at what they do and no one could ever argue that!

The Show is a great game, and that's not opinion, that's a FACT! Unless you're a hater like i said![/quote]

Bumble14

^^ I meant I MVP 05, and not "08" when speaking on the best baseball games. Add an "edit" button pasta! haha.

Bumble14

People who try and say 2K8 doesn't have framerate issues and that it is superior to the Show clearly have no played the show this year. It's that cut and dry.

I was all over Pasta before these games dropped forhis attitude on 2k, and I was standingup for 2k8 like it was my child--until I played both games.

Let's break it down like this- I played the Show on PS2 before I bought my PS3 and the Show on that-- and the PS2 version puts 2k8 to shame in terms of framerate and gameplay.

I'm an objective gamer- I love baseball- I choose the best baseball game on the market- I didn't even buy a baseball game until 2k7 because nothing could touch MVP 08 in my eyes....I can honestly say that if you are posting on this forum that 2k8 is a better game/has no issues, then you fall into the following categories:

1.) You only own a 360 and are mad because you don't have the option to buy the Show (completely understandable- but don't hate the Show because of this).

2.) You are not a true baseball gamer (i.e. you probably never played RBI, Bases Loaded, World Series 97 for the Saturn, High Heat 2000, or MVP05).

3.) You haven't played the Show (trust me- once you play it and watch it's buttery smooth frame rate and tight gameplay controls-not to mention amazing animations, ball/bat physics, and outstanding computer managerial AI....then you try to play MLB 2K8 again it is a complete joke)

4.) All of the Above.

I'm a self proclaimed baseball video game expert- I've played them all since the NESday, and will go toe to toe with anyone that wants to debate baseball games. MLB 08 The Show is simply phenominal--I have NEVER played a baseball game that just feels like baseball like this years edition manages to pull off. MVP 05 will always be king to me, but I believe the crown has been passed this year.

To even defend 2k8 is a joke- and anyone who gives it a higher score than the Show loses all credibility right there. Sorry folks, but MLB 2K8 is probably one of the weakest baseball games I have seen since the N64 days. In fact, I popped in my copy of Griffey for N64 the other night for some comparaisons, and somehow that game runs at a smoother framerate, and has a tighter all around feel to it than 2k8.

Argue all you want, but true baseball fans/gamers will tell you the Show is a solid 9...anything lower shows a complete lack of knowledge in anything baseball video game related.

o'rly

other than gametrailers.com 1up.com is one of the worst biased pro-certain game developers there like the cnn and foxnews of video games and they dont hide their biasness either...

CrimsonVoodoo

Last post on this - promise

Dillfav - You must have played a special "extra-choppy" MLB2K8, because the one I own is certainly stutterrific during cuts scenes and replays, but from pitch to hit to throw runs at least competently. I read at another site an opinion from someone I respect, who had just bought the game. It basically amounted to WTF? he had assumed from all the strum & drang that the game was a slideshow, which it's not. Lots of people are merrily playing the game in a very sim fashion and not burning 2K staff in effigy. Really.

Night Owl - thanks for playing into the zealot role so easily. Your post is the one that sums up what I don't get - the CAPS and !!!!!!!! and the "haters" and the rest. Hey, some people DON'T like Prince's guitar playing, and I'm not sure if you actually read the review the guy was all that harsh and saying the game sucked. He just didn't fawn over it and call it the greatest thing since sliced bread, which seems to be a crime

Reviews, outside of whatever specs they provide, are nothing but opinions, and are legitmate. Some movie critics think Citizen Kane is overrated. Some music critics think the Beatles were overrated. Either way you may disagree, but it doesn't make the other person's view less true to them

Enjoy the game (whichever one it is) - no one's opinion should stop you from doing so, and frankly, that's all that matters. Or SHOULD matter anyway

The Night Owl

Anyone thay gives The Show anything less than an 8 is just a plain hater....PERIOD!

Some things are just FACT and not opinion! That's like someone saying Jordan can't play basketball or Prince can't play a guitar. There are some idiots out there that would argue those points with an opinion and say Jordan sucked on the court or Prince is a horrible guitar player. But the FACT is that they both are GREAT at what they do and no one could ever argue that!

The Show is a great game, and that's not opinion, that's a FACT! Unless you're a hater like i said!

Timothy Daley

There is personal opinion then there is clear favoritism. Todd Zuniga over at 1UP and formerly of EGM magazine has been a 2k baseball homer ever since the franchise came to be.

He routinely torpedoed EA's baseball game each year and he does the same thing with Sony's product. Unfortunately what Todd doesn't realize is that gamers have eyes, ears, and most importantly a functioning brain.

There is no surprise that 1UP's review of the show is what it is. Intelligent gamers already know the deal. All 1UP and G4's reviews accomplish is to certify there incompetence and lack of credibiltiy.

Dillfav

[quote comment="15799"]I would like to say that I learned something valuable from this blog post, but all I heard was, "BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW, someone didn't like a game I liked!!!!"[/quote]
You must have been on your elementry schools debate team. You are awesome! wow..............

Someguy

I would like to say that I learned something valuable from this blog post, but all I heard was, "BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW, someone didn't like a game I liked!!!!"

Chase

[quote comment="15790"][quote comment="15781"]There's no true convergence scale for a B- regardless of what Metacritic puts up -- and using Metacritic as an argument point still is shenanigans to me but that's a different argument -- and 1UP has made that clear. A B- is a B- which seems to be in letter form still a good score.[/quote]

They went and converted all their past reviews to the letter scores, meaning there actually is an accurate scale. 5-5.5=C, 5.6-6.1=C+, 6.2-6.7=B-, 6.8-7.5=B ect.

I've seen a lot of mentions that reviews are just opinions. Which is true to a certain extent. However an opinion would be fun factor, or that 2K8's pitching is better than The Show's, those type of things. An opinion isn't someone struggling with and then complaining about a simple meter pitching system. Thats just ignorance and nitpicking. An opinion isn't ignoring the smooth framerate, or in large part the gameplay and graphics. An opinion isn't going into the game knowing you aren't going to give it a fair shot. If this review was centrally based on opinion I could almost understand it, even though it would clearly out stand in the sea of positive opinions out there. Its just made especially interesting by the history involved and definitely curious on that front.

Yeah I'm no fan of this metacritic age, but thats what we are living with right now. So the importance placed on reviews is higher than ever. That is why people are looking for a certain level of responsibility to be shown.[/quote]

They did convert, but they even said that many times before there wasn't really a convergence, but due to pressures they made due, so I should have specified that.

If someone can't handle a meter that's not user error that's just him having issues, and it's not the first time I've heard someone struggling with the "simple" meter. Like I said before they take a bit of a more casual approach to sports reviews that perhaps to you or me is sometimes hard to comprehend, but I don't think it should simply be discounted.

And still I think it's unfair to say they weren't going to give the game a fair shot. Like I said, Zuniga wasn't even the one who did the review this year, even though he "lowballed" the game last year. This is a company with a very good track record in terms of editorial integrity, who has been stripped of game coverage and advertising numerous times in the past and hasn't budged...So why they pick Sony Sports to pick a bone with is just not logical to me.

Metacritic has its own issues though because it averages out certain scores and gives them more weight than other reviews; thus Metacritic states one review is more important than another.

Dillfav

[quote comment="15780"]I don't use the announcers so I don't care about that. From what I played, I liked the Show. Besides the "obvious by now" framerate issue w/2k, you sound like you haven't played the game at all and are reaching...btw, the animations and sigs are better than anything the Show has. I said they both need work tho...I just prefer 2k's controls alot more right now..................sorry-[/quote]
lol, this is funny to me, I know Pasta personally, and I can tell you, if anything, he is an Xbox 360 fan boy. He has both games, I know becuase I have played them both, on his system. So to you I would say, know what you are talking about before you say something dumb. Also, how can you praise 2k's "animations" when the game craps on it self every time a ball is hit on the field. Animation equales images in motion, if the frame rate sucks, the ANIMATION sucks, so yea, great point dude.

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