Making Sense of the Mike Wang News

by pastapadre
Posted February 2nd, 2010 at 4:00 pm

Both EA Sports and 2K Sports have now presented their spin on the Mike Wang departure from EA and return to 2K. EA states that NBA Live will continue with a sim focus while 2K is attempting to make Live look bad while boosting their own cred. As with most things of this nature the truth likely lies somewhere in between the the extremes being presented.

When Mike Wang left 2K to go to EA he cited reasoning that NBA 2K had hit a ceiling and the game wouldn’t be able to make big improvements from year to year. Now that he’s parted from EA he and a few of his 2K development team members have launched a scathing attack with the goal to discredit NBA Live and the structure of EA Sports. Given that the public animosity is nothing new between these two sides the motivation behind it has to be considered. Still there is surely some truth behind the comments and frustration being communicated.

Ultimately right now this looks like a move made more to bury NBA Live than to improve NBA 2K. Whatever traction Live had gained over the past year and a half has taken a hit because the guy driving those gameplay advancements ditched the series. However he is going to a game where the current gameplay is a perceived strength not a weakness. What NBA 2K has suffered from instead is poor quality control and a terrible online experience.

With references made to EA wanting to change the focus of NBA Live, Wang is insinuating that the game is going away from sim and towards arcade. That may be partially true but it depends on perspective. It is hard to believe that EA would want Live to become an arcade game when they have NBA Jam coming down the pipeline. The NBA restricts and requires certain things of them which is why they had separate licenses for the sim offerings and arcade offerings in the past. So the changes could be more along the lines of a push for accessibility or a feature set that doesn’t mesh with the sim gameplay.

It makes some sense to tweak the direction of NBA Live. With the competitor having the hardcore sim market cornered they have to find a way to differentiate and attract other consumers. That being said they can’t alienate the current fans of the series either which is a risk when any change is made. Poor sales are always going to lead to things being reevaluated. It should come as no surprise that Live would pushing a different angle and that NCAA Basketball would be canceled. Sales drive those decisions.

Thing is the vast majority of gamers will never know about this story and would never care who works on what game. They are going to make purchase decisions the same way they always have. Considerations such as loyalty, comfort, new features, demo, word of mouth, and so on will remain.

I criticized both sides for bickering when 2K started with an attack on Live 10′s patch and then Live responded with a tacky blog highlighting consumer discontent with 2K10. However I have a hard time thinking that EA shouldn’t respond to the comments that have been made. They can’t just sit around and let this all sink in if they truly believe they are being misrepresented.

I’ve said it many times before but this really is a make or break year for the NBA Live franchise. If the sales aren’t encouraging it is at risk of being cut. Regardless of beliefs on which game is better most appreciate that there is competition between the two games which has pushed innovation and improvements. I don’t think anyone would be pleased if the market went from five sim basketball options each year to just one in the matter of three years.

Tags: latest news

andro

really good recap of whats going on and how it could matter to gamers. appreciate the article
Lake Allen

Definitely worried about where Live goes from here but I guess worrying doesnt do any good. I'll wait to see what EA shows us when the time comes.
EEO

no doubt wang is exaggerating probs at ea, its why he had his buddies there with him to rub it in even more. but still makes me nervous about live this year anyway.
Eros

the end of nba live is coming yeah its kinda sad since i grew up with the game guess ill have to make the switch
2oHo

sounds to me like he was just really stubborn. didnt get what he wanted at 2k so left them and badmouthed them. then didnt get his way at ea so decided to go back while burning the bridge on the way. never thought someone would make it such a big deal to rip his employers on the way out
gomagic

i would just like to know how EAC is so inefficient when it is the development studio responsible for all the recent Sports Games of the Years with the NHL and FIFA series. To me it sounds like Mike has a huge ego and wanted his way or the highway.
http://pastapadre.com/ pastapadre

Its a good question, at least in terms of structure it hasn't inhibited those two titles from succeeding. Hard to know how the situations between the games differ but its something to consider that those two have succeeded in the same environment.
HA HA!!!

The Sean Hannity of EA sports, reporting on MSNBC VC. Dude you have no credibilty whatsoever when it comes to anything related to 2K, you wear your EA glasses to sleep with you.
percy

thanks for the info and impressions of the situation rounded things up nicely and understand things a little more now
Oliver

Both games need help which is why this news is so big. 2K has dropped off the last two years and Live has gotten better but still needs work. So having him move back over makes it look like 2K has the better chance of being great next year.
rustler

mike wang aint got anything to do with 2ks shitty servers and broken online modes so unless thats fixed i dont care about him being back
On The Run

Thanks for the balanced look at the situation. Both companies are exaggerating things their direction.
22-Drive

cant believe its the beginning of february and basketball games that wont be out for 8 months are the big topic lol
MZ360

With the way 2K Sports is going, Wang might've made a bad move going back to 2K Sports..

MLB 2K has got them in a hole.
SharksBreath

It's not hard that EA want Live to be an arcade game. It's been an arcade game since Live 2001.
SharksBreath

It's definitely something obviously wrong. Live has been a failure for over a decade even though those two titles have succeeded.

I could care less what company makes the better game. But I won't sit and play an inferior product “Like Pasta” just because I have love for the company.

To be truthful I feel sorry for Pasta. He shows loyalty to a company for what. It's like a mental illness. . Seriously. The guy needs his head examined.

In 2008 he chose to play one of the worst offerings from EA over the greatest basketball simulation I ever played. NBA2k8.

Right then I knew he was crazy.
gunlove

Pasta you are the Bill O Reilly of sports gaming. Only you are the “independant” in this issue, but really you are for EA saying “Ea has to respond!” and they “Can't sit around and take this!” So what who cares?

It is one producer out of many. I have been following this bs for years on this site and maddennation and others and it really doesn't matter. What all this has come down to is the recession has hit the game industry hard and the lack of roster updates vs years past is the most obvious of examples.

Mike Wang, who cares Nba 2k and Live have been the same for years only little tweaks here and there that we really think are major but in the grand scheme of things aren't. Nba live “Made Huge Strides” according to this site. Well it sucked so bad it didn't matter what they did it would be have to be an improvement. And so they did and all the live fanboys gave credit to Mike Wang and now he left and they are left to make excuses,,,,,,,kinda like this article.
raydelizo35

Padre,

Definitely on point with your assessment that this is a critical year for NBA Live. It'll be very interesting to see how EA attempts to regroup from losing someone the caliber of Wang.
http://pastapadre.com/ pastapadre

I fail to see where any “excuses” are being made. The point about responding is if they don't, they people will assume that what was said was true. If it is than they'll stay quiet. But if that's not the case they can't let that perception brew for six months and think releasing a blog or something about a new feature will change that.
Larry

good writeup. if anything at least things will be interesting. gotta think ea will battle back somehow and 2k will be trying to end the competition. two really good games maybe? or not lol but no point in being too negative right now
deepen03

welcome back to 2k Mike Wang now lets go and get that championship of SIM Basketball and keep it for good.
Sportsgamer

Even the EA Community Manager yesterday said Mike is moving to bigger and better things. haha

Ea suits only care about money. This 2 years or whatever Wang had with them didnt work out in numbers. The game improved, but suits do not give a flying fuck about if the game improved. They care about the numbers they see on paper on how the game sold. Its no different then a assistant coach or a head coach on a team that resigns because his owners arent getting him what they need to compete.

In the end, i think its EA not giving their head coach what he needs to make the game he wanted. You cant hold them back. You have to let their vision play out. If they didnt want to do that with him then whats the point of him staying in Canada? Let me see. San Fran or Vancouver? hmm. Place where i lived and good friends or Cold ass Canada and a new place? Stay here and be miserable because they aren't letting me do what needs to be done, or go back to where i was and they gave me that freedom.

IN the end. Mike tried something new and it didnt work out. its as simple as that.
plagerist

Wow Pasta you copied this word for word from the comments on the 2 live threads on OS.. I mean literally……
plagerist

Wow… deleted my comment.. You copied the comments from the 2 OS live thread verbatim to write this entire article.
gamer

LOL pastapadre. deleteing comments. just admit you plagerized this article from comments ont eh 2 OS threads in teh live section….
jusmegamer

This does not look like move to bury Live to me because to me Live has been burried for years. The truth is simple, he went to EA and came back to 2K. Pasta and every other fanboy in the world can spin it as they choose, but the truth is he tried something and he did not like it, good day.
stevvvvvve

why would anyone want nba live to be canceled…? think about it having just one bball game 2k wouldnt have to worry about improving much it especially showed this year since they really didnt change anything to the game i think…it shows with madden especially which i think got lazy with no competition cause your pretty much screwed n have no choice but madden for a sim football game.. its gonna end up the same way with 2k ..slow to come out with new innovations in gameplay and etc..u need competition to strive …even though i think nba live is ran by idiots and do not know how to make a sim basketball game…but they can get fifa and nhl right ….
wangchung2nite

EA should sign former NBA great Zhi Zhi Wang just to hit 2K in the Wang!
thaprob7em

nba 2k10 is not all that great. I still can't figure where all this hype came from that gamers bought into. Programmers come and go. no big deal. whatever mike wang added 2 Live is just a building block 4 Ea Sports 2 keep going on. Live 10 is a GREAT GAME. With some minor tweaking in a few key areas Live will be over the top soon. NBA2K10 is a good game at best. still kinda stiff 2 me. Live 10 has more of that drama feel 2 it that makes the games competitive.
JZ

This year I bought NBA Live 10 b4 NBA 2k and it was straight up trash, Couldnt even play a season less then 82 games and the ball and players went through each other which can not be ignored. When I am playing a game and watch the ball go though a defender leg I stop playing.

I ended up buying NBA 2k which made me realise how good I had it and how I can let the little stuff go. NBA 2ks rosters were horrible but the last month the insider finally did some work and brought them up to par.

With Madden, and Live been garbage this year EA has lost me for along time if not forever.

JG

Okay dude so go ahead and lie and say NBA 2K10 has no clipping in the game, make a fool out of yourself in order to be a hater. I love it when so called sim lovers bitch about unrealistic things but want less than an 82 game season. If i’m not mistaken the real NBA doesn’t play less than that. It’s funny how you can some how let the little stuff go with 2K but Live is some how trash.

CRD13NYC

Why not? It happened with football. Except 2k didnt have to buy an exclusive contract… they just went and beat the pants off the game that had a 10+ years headstart in the market.I have confidence that 2k will continue to improve their series and not pull what seems to be a common practice @ EA Sports of releasing a sub-par title, lacking basic features;thinking that it will sell just off of name.
okafor43

Stick A fork in Live they was done even before Mike Wang left. The series is not selling and they are putting alot of money into the game with out much results. Now they are moving to the left with more Arcade appeal for those fans who like to jump 50 feet in the air for a rim rattling dunk….what a joke. Im dissapointed!
Fabian aka fabby

if they cancel live next year at least I wont have to buy two basketball games better for me and my tummy I can spend the 50 dollars on pizza and soda.

http://twitter.com/deepen03 deepen03

why would you buy two anyway man? you know 2k is the champ so why drop another 60 bucks for a waste of a game?

http://twitter.com/Valdarez Valdarez

Hilarious stuff Padre. So good that your an 'honest unbiased' blogger. You rarely fail to make me smile.
4YM3R1C

I think the most important question amid this whole PR BS, is what will happen of EA's NCAA Basketball game. Will they drop it for good ? If so, could 2k bring back the College Hoops franchise ?
dude

You should take your laptop upstairs and let your mom review this article before posting.

It should come as no surprise that Live would pushing a different angle and that NCAA Basketball would be canceled.

What does that even mean?
AmenRa

I agree with this 100%. Live sucks but I'm sick of all these 2k glitches, I turned 2k back in after 4 months. I would never buy that Live garbage,
bux

mabye his wife Adrian said “You cant WINNNNNNNNNNNNNNN” and he went back to 2K lol, Live is not a sim either… I rented that crap on a thursday and by sunday i had like 3/4 of the acheivements lol that shit is too easy. EA cant win them all Pasta damn. EA makes more games then all of theses companies… Just stop it bro
bux

look at madden, lol. why would we want one football game.
2KFanboyIGuess

NBA Live is definitely on life support. As much as I can't stand EA Sports over the last ten years, Live is a staple in basketball gaming. I want it to be around, but I don't see how EA has let the name become so cut-rate and second-hand over the years. I want to see Live vs. 2K for the next 20 years because it's good for everyone, but EA already has experience in that field.
dagamesta

I love how pasta replied to a EA question and spun it like a true spinner would.
Bl4ziNBuLLd0G

i love NBA 2k but theres just too much stupidity going around. they are talking smack about EA or least Mike Wang is, about stuff we obviously already knew was wrong with NBA live. then Mike Wang leaves to go to 2k?!? the company he's already left and trashed once? Not to mention the gaping hole already in their profits, thanks to that garbage of a baseball game MLB 2k and the huge success of EA's NHL series over NHL 2k. I just don't get it. EA can make a pretty good football game, an excellent soccer and hockey game, but they only thing they can't do well is basketball and 2k and Wang rips their throat for it. the only thing 2K Sports does well is basketball and arcade baseball (The BIGS). it just doesn't seem to make any sense to me.

Sportsgamer

How did he trash 2K when he left? he just said that the engine has been pretty much topped out. Is that terrible and horrible to day? I just dont see it that way. Their engine is still based of last gen engine. Its something that everyone had already known. Bashing your old company is what he did with that ESPN article. He just shit all over EA and did not flush.

Anonymous

look maybe i didn’t mean it to that extent but he did talk about the inefficiency of the organizations potential, however you wana take it….

Sportsgamer

Yes, To me Madden has been worse then 2K baseball has been. I cant even stand to finish a half. Game is just so broken in just about every phase of the game. They got kicking ok though.
Sportsgamer

Not at the asking price the NCAA wants. 2K already told them to shove that price.
http://twitter.com/deepen03 deepen03

have to make a switch? bro you should have made the switch in 2005. after that insult to basketball of NBA Live 06 on 360..
http://twitter.com/deepen03 deepen03

yup agreed.. I don't know why Pasta is on EA's dick.. In the back of his head. he knows that NBA 2k is and will always be the king of NBA Basketball games. But he stays supporting Live. Yea Live has made strides the last two years, but the track record proves that 2k is still the champ.
http://twitter.com/deepen03 deepen03

yea 2k10 may not be perfect, but its as close as you get to watching an ESPN broadcast. The graphics have finally completely leapfrogged NBA Live finally, so you can't even say anything about that. None of NBA Live's players look like their real-life counterparts. 2k has surpassed them in that regard. and lets no even get into gameplay comparisons. 2k10 speaks for itself on that.
http://twitter.com/deepen03 deepen03

yea but with him at Visual Concepts, maybe he can even help the MLB crew a little bit..
http://twitter.com/deepen03 deepen03

yup all EA cares about is sales sales sales. 2k actually cares about their consumers (MLB 2k sucks but thats not the point) The NBA 2k series has been solid since 1999.
http://twitter.com/deepen03 deepen03

exactly.. 2k doesn't need exclusive rights to prove anything. they came in and beat two of EA's longest lasting sports games. (nba live and madden) and then EA got scared and bought the NFL deal. Im just happy the NBA hasn't signed a deal with EA like that..