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View Full Version : Quarter Length, Accelerated Play Clock, Stats, & Game Time


Enderz
08-20-2009, 04:24 PM
I've been noticing that the stats in my offline franchise have been way off using 7 min quarters and a 20 second accelerated play clock (APC).

It was a slow afternoon at work so I pulled some stats off NFL.com to try and figure out what combination of quarter length and accelerated clock you might need to get realistic stats (and how long those games might take you to actually play).

In 2008 here were the NFL average game stats:

Plays from Scrimmage = 62 (+/- 5)
No. of Kickoffs = 9.5
No. of Punts = 8.5
No. of FG's = 3.9
No. of PAT's = 4.6
Total No. of Plays = 88.5

There were also an average of 5.6 penalties per game, but there was no way to separate out which ones overlapped or were in addition to the play counts listed above. I also did not account for overtime games. Since these play totals include overtime plays, the actual average number of plays per game in regulation might be lower by 1 or 2. Given these two differences (one that would increase the avg and one that would decrease it) I just went with the 88.5 number.

If there are 88.5 plays per game and a regulation game lasts 3600 seconds (60 min/game * 60 seconds/min) that comes out to an average of 40.1 seconds of game clock per play. This includes all of the time between the end of one play and the end of the next.

One of the reasons we've always been able to get realistic stats (roughly equating to running a realistic number of plays per game) without playing full 15 minute quarters is that play calling in a video game is so much faster than in real life.

By picking your play quickly and getting the snap off before the clock had gotten to 15-20 seconds just about every play (compared to 0-10 in the real NFL) you could pack a realistic number of plays into 7 minute quarters (essentially averaging closer to 20 seconds per play rather than the NFL’s 40). But if you use accelerated play clock and are (or plays someone) who likes to call a lot of audibles at the LOS you will probably end up averaging closer to 30 or 40 seconds per play resulting in a lot fewer plays per game.

Put together the following tables to estimate the effects of various play calling styles, quarter lengths, and APC settings on the number of plays per game and elapsed time per game.

With APC set to 20 seconds:

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_G9-swvho1C4/So3WKI97BlI/AAAAAAAAAKA/wYv9Je5AAQk/s720/JFL_ACP_7.jpg

With APC set to 15 seconds:

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_G9-swvho1C4/So3YARA1_CI/AAAAAAAAAKM/yd_q2hInSG4/s720/JFL_ACP_15.jpg

So the bottom line seems to be that in order to get more realistic stats we might want to consider going with 14 min quarters with a 20 sec APC (assuming none of us are slow play callers).

This would give us roughly 90 plays per game (equivalent to the NFL) and games would take about an hour (40-45 min of clock time and 15-20 mins of non-clock time based on the original 28 min clock time games taking about 45-50 min to play).

What do you guys think? Has anyone tried using higher quarter lengths with the APC to see what the play counts and other stats look like?

thbends
08-20-2009, 04:33 PM
Leave it to the Science guy to break it down like that! LOL

Interesting though. I would be cool with 10 to 12 minute quarters with 20 sec acc. clock. I think that is what I read some people are using. 14 sounds like a long game. You sure it would just be an hour?

It is a video game so scoring seems to happen more in it to me.

Akzo
08-20-2009, 06:04 PM
That seems a little long to me. I would say nine minutes max. You score more often per play in Madden than they do in the actual NFL. 90 plays per game will give you Arena type stats.

Do you want to schedule a game at your suggested settings and present the results?

n=1

Enderz
08-20-2009, 06:25 PM
I agree 14 sounds pretty long. I'll try 10 w/ 20 APC tonight in my offline franchise and see what it does.

Akzo, I'll look for you if you're on tonight and if we hook up I'll send you an invite with these settings.

Enderz
08-20-2009, 09:42 PM
Akzo and I just finished our 10 min w/ 20 APC game. Think I may have been wrong about how the APC works. Seems like setting it at 20 takes up to 20 sec off the clock depending on where you call the play which would tend to be a more aggressive setting than 15 (i.e. would shorten the game and reduce the number of plays).

With these setting we ended up running
ATL offense = 42 plays
STL defense = 46 plays
Total from scrimmage = 88 vs 62 in the NFL (yikes!)
Punts = 1 vs 8.5
KO's = 11 vs 9.5
FG's = 2 vs 3.9
PAT's = 7 vs 4.6
Total Plays = 109 vs 88.5

Surprisingly the game clocked in at right around 1 hour despite the 20 additional plays. Score was 35-28 and both teams had right around 350 yards of total offense (90 rushing / 260 passing).

Based on these numbers it looks like 8 min with 20 sec APC might give us the right number of total plays. What do you guys think?

Travan
08-21-2009, 01:13 AM
We also have to factor in that we play most of our games against the CPU which could account for some faster play calling. In my game against the Ravens, I ran 70 offensive plays. I passed 32 times and rushed 38 times. So based on averages, if I had played 10 minute quarters, My offense alone would have run 100 plays from scrimmage. That's not including PATs, punts and kickoffs. Total plays for the game would have easily exceeded 200 plays. I personally don't think there will be a way to nail it down that will make it any more realistic across the board. Different speeds in play calling make it impossible.

RTShoe
08-21-2009, 06:18 AM
I agree with the 8 minute crowd, I think once guys figure the game out a bit anything longer than that will result in some insanely high scoring.

jiplum
08-21-2009, 11:29 AM
I think 8 minutes is fine.

bigfnjoe96
08-21-2009, 02:46 PM
I say 10 minutes with 15 sec. Accelerated PC. :ninja:

Akzo
08-21-2009, 04:33 PM
Fun game Enders. Tit for tat until the clock ran out (on me). Thank god for trucking running backs :). <-- Emoticon.

I thought the game was a tad longer than one hour, and we were playing at break-neck speed. I would like a little more time to select the play, five seconds longer is all I ask (I don't know if that's 15 or 25 APC). Nine minute quarters would be my preference, but I'm cool with eight or ten, but not 14.

Enderz
08-22-2009, 06:20 AM
I agree with Akzo on going with 15 instead of 20 as the APC setting. With it set at 20 we were already in the red zone (<10 sec to snap) by the time we got to the line. 15 should give you enough time on offense to send 1 man in motion, call 1 hot route, or motion for extra protection against the blitz, but not enough to get carried away with it.

I would prefer 9 min quarters (1 hr game + realistic stats vs. the CPU teams), but I could go with 8. Agree that 10 might lead to longer games and excessive scoring.

RTShoe
08-22-2009, 06:48 AM
Just a quick note on scoring, the avg NFL game has roughly 44 points total scored give or take a fraction, the record is something just over 46 per game for a season. With 10 games played here so far on 7 minute quarters we're already averaging 51.8 points per game.

If we go to 10 minute quarters and that pace holds we'll be averaging close to 74 points per game. Even at 8's were going to be pushing 60 per contest. Not to mention the game's only been out a week and we're still adjusting, I'd expect scoring to go up over the coming weeks.

The game is clearly offensively minded, so I guess my point is that it would appear we'll need to make a choice, between reasonably accurate SCORING or reasonably accurate STATS. I'm not sure the game can be balanced to achieve both.

SecondSundodger
08-22-2009, 07:29 AM
This is a tough one. Lacking a clear choice for improved realism, I'd be tempted to just leave off the accelerated play clock and go with 6 or 7 minute quarters, so that everyone can always trust the on-screen indicators to set their strategy, instead of intermittently forgetting 15 or 20 seconds are about to evaporate away pre-snap.

I guess what I'm saying is that if we can't figure out a length/acceleration set-up that (most) everyone agrees creates a more realistic NFL experience, we should go with what's more useful for competition at the meta/gamer level.

RTShoe
08-22-2009, 07:34 AM
I don't mind the 15 sec AC, my main worry is in extending the game length to more closely approximate the number of snaps in a game to an actual NFL game. The offense is much more effective in the game than in the real world, and the extra snaps will lead to some pretty high scores. I don't have any issue with 42-35 games as long as everyone realizes going in that's what we're going to have. ;)

Enderz
08-22-2009, 09:03 AM
The game is clearly offensively minded...

Or maybe we all just suck at defense :)

My main concern in offline franchise was that my players had no chance of ever winning player of the week or season awards since their stats were always so much lower than all of the CPU players. Would expect the same thing in online franchise with all the CPU teams.

I tend to give up a lot of points (and score a lot too) so I don't really have a problem with the total scores being too high, but some of the more defensively minded players (Soop, ElMag) might.

Akzo
08-22-2009, 10:45 AM
This is a good discussion, No one has said anything I disagree with. I think SSD makes a good point about the meta game (if you can't be with the game you love, love the game your with). I think we need to put up a poll on Quarter length and APC. The stats and scores will fall where they will.

D is Key, and hopefully scoring will come down eventually as we get more experience.

I'm enjoying this game more than I expected. I'm going away for a week and won't be able to play but I'll stop by here. Will my 360 fit on my carry on?

thbends
08-22-2009, 02:44 PM
I set the quarter length to 8 minutes and 20 APC for now. Seems to be what most agree on... however before we kick off the "reset season" it can be adjusted if needed.

The 13fhApostle
08-28-2009, 05:14 PM
While I'm way to late to this conersation to contribute anything, I would just like to say I"m super happy it was discussed. That is all.

Enderz
08-28-2009, 06:01 PM
8 minutes seems to be working pretty well in my offline franchise.

I would probably vote for 15 APC since it gives you a few extra seconds at the LOS to call at least 1 audible. With 20 APC it seems like you pretty much have to snap as soon as you get to the line. Any other opinions on 15 vs. 20 APC?

MM Jester
08-28-2009, 07:43 PM
8 minutes seems to be working pretty well in my offline franchise.

I would probably vote for 15 APC since it gives you a few extra seconds at the LOS to call at least 1 audible. With 20 APC it seems like you pretty much have to snap as soon as you get to the line. Any other opinions on 15 vs. 20 APC?

I agree Enderz.

15 seconds is better. I always find myself needing just a tinge more time at the line of scrimmage. Just a couple more seconds would help in a big way.

Can we roll w/ 15 secs?

thbends
08-28-2009, 07:57 PM
I currently have it set at 8 min. with 15 sec APC

adriancat1963
08-29-2009, 01:48 PM
Cool

thbends
08-29-2009, 07:54 PM
I think this might be a little short. Seemed like my week 1 game did not have enough time to me.

Michael1807
09-01-2009, 02:53 PM
i would go to 10min 15sec acc...seems to be a good time, realistic stats and games are still under an hour